"reboot Required" Alerts

Options
Chimel
edited November 2011 in Feature request

I am running in Auto Pilot and Autoscan modes; As a consequence, I normally never open the Security Center.


However, I noticed that some updates require a reboot, and may have been for several days.


The reboots are set to Postponed in my settings, and this is as should be because I don't want to lose any work or interrupt any task.


1) Can you make this particular alert visible in the Notification icon?


Maybe change the color to orange like when there is a normal alert, and change the tooltip from "You are in Auto Pilot Mode" to "A computer reboot is required for the Bitdefender update to take effect" or something.


2) When there is already one red unread "Reboot required" event, do NOT add hundreds of events every few minutes.


There should be only one red unread such event at most.


If the customer read the event but did not take action, by all means generate a new unread event, but it's the same event, not hundreds of different events that require rebooting every few minutes. Just the one red event clearly appears in red in the Events page's left pane, so the user can't miss it even if there is only one.


So many events also hide the real events from different categories. All you see is "99+" and you may think it's all the reboot required events that will get fixed when you'll reboot at the end of the day, but there might actually be other more important events that require your immediate attention, and you'll never know until you actually open the Events page.


3) I haven't checked, but I think that after the reboot, these events do not disappear and still show as 99+ red unread alerts.


Can you make sure that after the reboot, all these events, or the one remaining if you fix that issue, are set to read?


4) If this generates a red colored event, obviously the top pane should display it as an orange alert at least to be consistent.


As I understand, the update is not effective until the reboot, so it is critical for my security and I want this alert to be treated as such.


5) The update is not replacing Windows kernel, so there is zero reason why a reboot should be required.


I don't know if the Windows Restart Manager API can be used in contexts other than normal installers, for your silent updates for instance, but please consider a secure way of shutting down Bitdefender completely and automatically restarting the service and apps, so that no reboot is necessary. Or redesign your files so that the Bitdefender kernel file never changes across all updates of the same version, and all other files and libraries and services can be shut down safely for update purposes or something.

Comments

  • rootkit
    rootkit ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    Options

    Hi Chimel


    I will analyze all the information provided with my colleagues and get back to you with an answer.


    Thank you.

  • Thanks, Cristi. Ignore #3, I checked that after rebooting, these alerts were set to "read".

  • chrisj
    Options

    Just adding my observations & opinions:


    I fully agree that the "reboot required" events are excessive - approximately every 15 minutes is what I've observed. And if one doesn't go look for them, they never get done, especially if the computer is up 24/7, as are mine.


    Just changing the color of the icon in systray is not enough - most users probably wouldn't notice it.


    I like Chimel's #5 idea, about restarting BD's services rather than a reboot. But if that is not possible, then....


    My own suggestion: go back to the way it used to be. That is, when a reboot is required, a pop-up. The pop-ups were reasonably unobtrusive, and gave the user the option to do it now or later. If this idea is ultimately adopted, the text in the pop-up should also say something to the effect of: "at your convenience".


    Basically, let the user know that a reboot is required, without having to open the app to find out. And don't do it more often than is necessary - maybe every 5 or 6 hours.


    Chris

  • rootkit
    Options

    Hello :)


    I will post new details here in a few hours.


    Thank you for your patience.

  • rootkit
    Options

    Hi :)


    I'm back.


    I made a feature request for 1, 2 and 4.


    Regarding number 5, this will not be implemented in the product because during the product update, all services are turned off. And doing this with the machine connected to the internet, leaves the user vulnerable.


    Also, in some cases, the loaded drivers can not be replaced by simply tuning off the services. Thank you.

  • Thanks for the feature requests, Cristi. I still think the reboot situation is not final and unsolvable, there is always room for improvement, including for #5, so I'll leave you these last words for the product team before you close the thread:


    Bitdefender is already out of phase in Windows 7, with the number of Windows Updates reboots drastically reduced, and according to Windows 8 blog, more effort has been done to reduce the need to reboot even further.


    I agree that a security product like Bitdefender can't let the user vulnerable at any moment, but wouldn't it be possible to turn off the networking services for a few seconds to copy the one or few driver/service files required, or work with Microsoft to find out what would be the best secure design to do so? Same as with the reboots, this should not be automatic but based on a manual decision from the user.


    It would also be much faster (a few seconds) to click on a link to disconnect the computer and replace the files (that have already been downloaded locally) compared to the whole reboot process, and it would allow your software to work for computers that need to stay on and available 24/7, opening a new market for Bitdefender.

  • rootkit
    Options

    Welcome back :)


    It's a great idea to turn off the networking services for a few seconds, but what about those users that are using wireless USB modems? Cutting the network service solves one issue(and it's easy to restart a service), but it creates another one: you have to turn off and back on the modem's software(the one from Vodafone, Orange or any other provider) in order for the connection to be restored. :)


    Thank you.

  • What about those users (the vast majority) who are not? ^-^


    Most mobile users with a wireless modem will probably have access to a WiFi spot at some stage during the day, so Bitdefender can wait for a few hours before proposing to disconnect, but even if they don't, it can't be that hard to restart the modem's software, maybe with some input from the user the first time, to identify the software to switch off and on.


    Not sure if that's even necessary, you can probably switch off the networking service for a few seconds to move the file(s) over without closing the modem's software. Network disruptions happen, the modem software probably tolerates this situation.


    All I'm saying is that there is still room for improvement, and creative programming can solve any such issues.


    Bitdefender currently requires too many reboots to be considered as a usable security software in many cases, like 24/7 servers.


    Even as a simple user, reboots frustrate me, and this problem will take more importance with Windows 8.

  • rootkit
    Options

    Welcome back


    I will talk these days with our lowers. I need to see if we are legally allowed to close network connections without user intervention(if your request gets approved, the update will have to be done silently with Auto Pilot turned ON and without user intervention).


    I will get back to you next week. Thank you.

  • Thanks, Christian. I suggest that, at least for the Windows platform, you talk to your Microsoft rep for guidelines on what's the best and most secure non-hack way to implement these silent installs, since they have recently done a lot of work in this area.

  • rootkit
    Options

    Welcome back Chimel


    The meeting is scheduled on Wednesday, so I will have the answer by Friday afternoon.


    Thank you.

  • Chimel
    Options

    The constant multiple "Reboot required" message seems to be fixed, I see only one "Reboot required" red alert now in my events.


    Well, partially fixed, because there is no way to be aware that a reboot is required unless you actively open the Bitdefender interface and check out your events every day, which of course nobody does. I don't know for how many days that alert was there but invisible to me; this is not good, what's the point of an alert that doesn't alert customers?


    For a full fix, I'd prefer to see the Bitdefender icon in the Notification Area go orange or something, with a tooltip that says "A reboot is required for the latest update to be completed" instead of the useless "You are in Auto Pilot Mode" that doesn't tell you anything that matters or that you don't know already.

  • rootkit
    rootkit ✭✭✭
    edited March 2012
    Options

    Hello :)


    In build .36 a new feature was implemented. Basically you will receive just one Event regarding the Reboot operation and we are working to implement a message in the main interface to display a orange status after 7 days. After one week(if you don't restart the PC), the product will display that warning and provide a Fix button that will restart the PC.


    Also, we are working to see if a pop-up near the clock is useful or just like you mentioned in the first post, the change or the system tray icon will do the trick :)


    I will post here more details when they will be made public.


    Have a great weekend.

  • Chimel
    Options

    Great, thanks. If it's still in design stage, I'd rather not wait a week and have the least obtrusive but most effective icon color change happen immediately at the same time as the "Reboot required" alert. It's a security product, so the earlier the notification the better, and some people might need to schedule such a reboot, so it makes sense letting them know as soon as possible.


    You know already I don't really believe in pop-ups, you guys seem to abuse them.


    There hasn't been many updates requiring a reboot lately, but there was a time last year when these reboots were frequent.


    Pop-ups for something so frequent should not be used, only for the exceptional.


    And I'm using Windows 7, I can't imagine what the pop-up experience will look like for people still using XP, like on a netbook.

  • rootkit
    rootkit ✭✭✭
    Options

    Hi Michel


    You must know that our developers are trying also to keep the "silent security" motto when they implement this :)


    This has also be implemented to work win Auto Pilot is either ON or OFF and it should not bother the user.


    I will let you know when the final solution is ready.


    Take care.

  • coolcool1227
    coolcool1227 ✭✭✭
    edited March 2012
    Options
    Welcome back


    I will talk these days with our lowers. I need to see if we are legally allowed to close network connections without user intervention(if your request gets approved, the update will have to be done silently with Auto Pilot turned ON and without user intervention).


    I will get back to you next week. Thank you.


    Closing the network connections during update has disadvantage that all users don't use download mangers for downloading and also all the download links are not resumable. So closing the network services without user intervention during update will be loss of bandwidth for non-resumable downloads. e.g if I am downloading a file of size 400 MB and able to download 350 MB from a non-resumable link and Bitdefender close the network connection. Then I have re-download it and also the 350 MB will be lost since may be I am using a limited bandwidth package.

  • Chimel
    Options

    Absolutely, it makes sense only if there is no file transfer or remote desktop or other relevant network activity.


    And I assume the infection risk while the antivirus is disabled is mostly for incoming connections and maybe new processes started automatically, so there may be no need to close outgoing connections.


    I have no clue what kind of protection is disabled and could be a risk during an update, but Bitdefender guys probably do. Reducing the number of cases that require a reboot would help even more. Maybe it's not even possible, or it could work only for client products such as BDAV or BDIS. I don't want just to reduce the risk of an infection, I want to keep 100% protected at all times, even when the antivirus is temporarily disabled for an update.

  • rootkit
    rootkit ✭✭✭
    Options

    Hello :)


    The only way you can keep the files protected is to always keep the shield turned on.


    Also, we can make some product updates when Windows is running that why in some cases the product will always ask for restart. It won't be that intensely, but you will notified somehow to reboot once an a while.


    Take care.