Observations

First of all, I'm really sorry you had to go thorugh all this with BitDefender. Believe me or not, many many times the problem it's not with the Antivirus product itself, but with the Operating System. I'll try to give you some sort of explanations to your problems that you experienced:

Bit Defender would not install and presumably would not run if any of my “tried and true” freeware programs were installed.

This is a basic in computer security: Do not use several security suites at once; they will interfere, they cause big trouble like system slow-downs, system instability or even system crushes. No one, and let me underline those words, can guarantee that 2 antimalware products will work fine installed on the same machine.

the visual interface and several other things were not functioning properly

"Several other things..."? Could you give us some detailed info about the `other ' problems? The GUI problem is well known, and it's cause isn't BitDefender itself, but the graphics card drivers/operating system. I had the same exact problem with BD 10 Plus on my GeForce video card, however, it seemed that the problem was gone on other video cards with other drivers installed.

DOES NOT FUNCTION as advertised, that offers NO REFUND and does offer VERY POOR TECH SUPPORT!

A refund can't be offered after you installed and used that software product.

I ran SOFTWINs “special uninstaller” and came to discover that the program had only PARTIALLY UNINSTALLED!!!

While BIT DEFENDER claimed itself to be completely uninstalled, Micro$oft Vi$ta Home Premium showed that Bit Defender was still installed and was still running!!! In fact, Bit Defender Internet Security 2008 was still listed in the Windows add/remove list! I attempted and failed to uninstall Bit Defender via several further attempts at re-running Bit Defenders’ “special uninstaller program” or via the Windows Add/Remove because SOFTWINs “special uninstaller” had IN FACT only partially removed the program!!!

Well... no excuse for sending the wrong uninstall tool.

Finally, I was able to get BIT DEFENDER I.S. 2008 installed on my new computer and it does appear to be functioning in some capacity

Again.. could you give us some examples of what is not working properly? If you don't tell us what exactly is not working well, we can't do anything to help you.

If SOFTWIN continues to ignore my complaints or if this BUGGY PROGRAM gets any worse, I’ll cut my losses and move on to another product.

We're sorry for your bad experience with BitDefender. But, if you help us by sending us feedbacks and bugs, we'll make the product better, and they will fix the bugs which you say that exist. (unfortunatelly, BitDefender still contains some bugs that are beeing fixed through updates).

On a final note, KUDOS AND CHEERS to NIELS and CRIS! Why they do what they do, I don’t know.

We are all volunteers here. We are usual BitDefender users, and we try to help other BitDefender users which experience problems. Indeed, Niels and Cris helped a lot the users of BitDefender.

Again, sorry for your bad experience. But if we cooperate, nothing bad can happen.

Happy new year!

Orphan, I can relate to a lot of your problems. At least you got some help from this forum. So far Bitdefender has me waiting again for answers to my bugs. I guess I will have to sit and wait and hope to get a response from someone. I have been computing since MSDOS 5.0 and I have never seen such lousy software or support. I am the very unproud new owner of Bitdefender IS 2008 with no support and as you said no refund.

Micro$oft has been writing software code for operating systems for some time now and if you check the number of PCs out there using Mcro$oft Operating systems, M$ stock quotes and Bill Gates’ financial status, I feel pretty safe in suggesting that Micro$oft has been pretty successful in what they do.

Window$ 98, Window$ ME, NT and 2000 have all been around since the mid-late ‘90s, XP has been around since the early ’00s and Vi$ta has been around for over a year and yet I can find reasonably fresh threads on this site stating problems with BitDefender running on ALL OF THESE OPERATING SYSTEMS! Somehow, I can’t quite envision Micro$oft consulting with SOFTWIN on how to build a proper operating system.

Let’s put the responsibility where it actually belongs! It is the responsibility of smaller software companies to keep up with the BIG DOGS who write the operating systems and actually run the show!

I don'want to seem like I don`t understand you or your problems, but what I can say now in addition (I don`t want to blame Microsoft now intsead of BitDefender, btw, BitDefender isn't a part of Softwin anymore, it's just "BitDefender"), but Microsoft is also well-known for several incompatibilities, starting with 95, 98, etc. I am a computer user for about 7 years now, but I also had the chance to experience with older OS like Win95, Win98, which, pretended to be "protected operating systems", with protected memory spaces for each tasks and for each critical component/driver of the OS system itself. If you have used Window$ 98, I don't think I have to tell you about the blue screen of death or about the less popular black screen of death, which caused the PC to crush without any clue of what is happening. With Windows XP, I have also experienced several problems (I am not a Windows Vista user yet), let's begin with video card driver incompatibilities, "WebCam driver for Windows XP" which actually caused my computer to enter in an infinite loop at every BOOT, and I could speak about these all day long. But let's get back to BD, which also seems to cause you unpleasent things. All I`m trying to say is that is is not only BD's fault.

GUI is something I’ve not had a problem with. My computer and ATI graphics card are both new, the drivers are all up to date and every software application installed on my machine, including Google Earth, runs perfectly, except for BITDEFENDER.

The same exact thing happened to all those who had GUI problems with BitDefender.

AndreiASM, I did not intentionally exclude you from the list of volunteers, I simply overlooked you in my smouldering anger with SOFTWIN.

All of volunteers here are greatly appreciated. But I can’t help but wonder why it is that the UNPAID volunteers here seem to be so much more knowledgeable than any of the PAID tech staff at SOFTWIN.

This is not what I really meant. I just wanted you to know that we do not work for BitDefender and we do all this because we are BD users for quite a while now and we have some knowledge about this software. We are not paid for our work, we are not beeing paid for worshiping BitDefender. We are just volunteers, average users which try to help others.

I will speak to someone inside and see what can be done.

Man -- after reading this post and several others, I've come to the conclusion that this product is NOT for me..

I am not a programmer, nor do I want to be.. I"m somewhat old fashioned, when I pays my money I expects the

product to work right out of the box.. This is why I no longer have MS VISTA installed on my computer, and why I won't

be purchaseing Bit Defender anytime soon..

Just because some users experienced problems with BitDefender doesn't mean tht the product is full of bugs and it's not working properly. I use it, and I don't have any problmes. Many other people use it, and, also, they don't have any problems. You should try a trial version before purchasing it, this is a basic when you're thinking of buying a software product. First, see if it meets your needs, by first running a trial version.

Happy new year!

If you install the trial version, I wish you the best in uninstalling it.

I don't know how to tell you, i had both trial versions. You have to uninstall BitDefender using the special Uninstall tool, you can find topics about this all over the forum. And yes, I had a happy uninstalling.

Happy new year!

Are you a programmer, or a company employee?? If you read some of the posts above, and in other threads on this forum, there are a number of complaints from people who have had little or no success with this program, or in uninstalling it when it does not work.. While there may be some of them with less computer experiance than I have, I'm sure there is an equal number with a great deal more computer experiance than I, and if they are having problems, then I know I will as well.. Part of decicing what software to purchase is researching it.. That is what I was doing when I came here, and what I'm seeing does not install a lot of confidence in this product..

I note that you stated that " I had both Total Security and Internet Security installed,".. Don't you have them installed anymore?? Why not??

Are you a programmer, or a company employee?? If you read some of the posts above, and in other threads on this forum, there are a number of complaints from people who have had little or no success with this program, or in uninstalling it when it does not work.. While there may be some of them with less computer experiance than I have, I'm sure there is an equal number with a great deal more computer experiance than I, and if they are having problems, then I know I will as well.. Part of decicing what software to purchase is researching it.. That is what I was doing when I came here, and what I'm seeing does not install a lot of confidence in this product..

I note that you stated that " I had both Total Security and Internet Security installed,".. Don't you have them installed anymore?? Why not??

I was a Beta Tester for BitDefender Total Security 2008, and I tested it both on my machine and in VM (Virtual Machine). I didn't have big problems with it. I stick to BitDefender IS because I don't want to interrupt my license with it, and replace it with the Total Security one. It would be a big waste (basically, I would loose almost 2 years of BD 2008 IS license period).

Yes, I am a programmer, but I don't work for BD. Cris is a programmer as well but he's not working for BD either. Most of the people register here because they have problems. Imagine that there were 1746 members by the time I was writing this post. Imagine that only a few of them registered here because they had problems. There are many members with 0 posts. There BitDefender emplyees, and there are members who registered just because they like BD. Now imagine that there are several milion users who use BitDefender. If BD would be so buggy and so bad as some of you say, the server would crush because of the number of members which would register to complaine! However this isn't the case. Why? Because many of them don't have problems.

Don't tell me that BD is the only software product that caused you trouble. There are infinite number of problems that can occure. I don't have any problem with IS 2008, btw.

VISTA very well may be the problem, but BitDefender advertises that their product(s) are VISTA COMPATIBLE!

That's not your fault and I DO NOT hold you volunteers responsible.

That's true. It caused you trouble. Let's remeber that it also caused trouble to some XP users. Does this mean that BD is incompatible with Vista or XP?!

Hello Orphan,

No, BD isn't the only software product that I've had trouble with. But I will tell you that BitDefender is the first software product that I've used where I have gotten NO ANSWERS to the problems I've experienced. And I will tell you that BitDefender is the first software company that has completely ignored my questions and requests.

I'll say it once again, ~BITDEFENDERs SILENCE IS DEAFENING!~

Well... I don't know what to say about this. Yes, I noticed that everybody says that BD Support doesn't really offer support. But when I joined this forum, I noticed a lot of users who switched from other products, saying that those products' support didn't answer at the problems. So this is not limited to BitDefender. (NO, this is not an excuse for BD's Support Team...it's just reality)

I suggest that both you and Cris experienced little trouble BitDefender products only because you both are computer programmers and you both knew how to fix or work around the problems you did experience with BitDefender.

That may be true.

But also, I have installed BitDefender at on my parents' computer and they have no clue about these things. And yet, BitDefender works fine there, also (and NO, not because I stay home and fix it; I stay in another city, because of my studies).

Also, I know at least two other persons who don't know that much about computers (they know how to use it, but at the first sign of trouble, they use a backup image and get it over with in a few minutes...) and also, BitDefender runs fine to them.

So your theory fails...end of story.

You know and I know that the majority of folks who have purchased BD products are not programmers nor are they even computer savvy. That is why some of them end up here, where they can question people whom have more computer experience.

Exactly! The majority are NOT programmers (are just usual users) and some of them end up here. What does this tell us?

That BitDefender is just a normal software. Yes, it has bugs (it even says in the EULA that it might have issues...did you read it? ). Nobody said it's perfect. But also, there are many users who are happy users of BitDefender (including normal, usual users).

Also: from the people who registered here to ask questions about problems, most of them came with small issues (how to do this, how to do that). Simple questions, simple answers, everyone's happy. Yes, there are some serious issues which appear in some cases (an example would be the vsserv runtime error), but I can count these issues using the fingers from one hand, and the number of users who experience these issues is relatively small.

Don't get me wrong, but the fact that the vsserv runtime error was very hard simulated in the labs proves that the conditions for that error to appear are very rare. And this is only an example.

What I want to say is: All serious issues are not general. They are bugs, yes. But still...they are rare bugs.

Now, I ask you, "How many people have contacted BitDefender Tech Support and/or come here to read the threads in search of solutions to their problems and have been severely disappointed with what they have found, and have simply uninstalled BD products and gone on to use alternate products?"

Those people would show as being registered on this forum and their post counts would also be ZERO.

And what makes you think that? You don't need an account to read the forum. You only need an account if you want to subscribe to the forum. So all those 0 post accounts tell us that there are many people that want to be up-to-date with the latest BitDefender news...nothing more.

FACT: There are threads here that are several months old and have never even been replied to!

Maybe, but consider this: we (the moderators) are only humans. We are not always available, nor we know the answers to all questions. If you know the answer to all questions and you have time to stay 24/7 here and post, then be my guest.

I received no anwer to my question the first time, so I'll ask the question once again,

I see above that AndreiASM mentions that BitDefender is no longer part of SOFTWIN.

Could this fact be the reason why the the newest versions of BD don't work as reliably as earlier versions and why tech support is so poor?"

We have no idea about this. We don't know (and, at least in my case, I don't care about) anything about BitDefender's internal politics. I'm here only as a volunteer and I'm trying to help how I can. The rest, what BitDefender does inside is out of my control, out of my knowledge and out of my circle of interest. Maybe Andrei will agree with me on this, maybe not... but these are my thoughts.

I don't particularly like to argue, but I also don't like being ripped off!

Nor do I.

I really am sorry because you have these problems. But still, forgive me for saying this: BitDefender offers a 30 day trial for all it's products. You can try them, without any limitations, for 30 days. That's more then enough to see IF there are any problems with it, IF you like the product, IF it suits your needs... etc. If you went directly to the store and bought the product without even testing it for 3 seconds before... then I'm sorry.

Again, I repeat: it's not OK that BitDefender has these problems. But still, from having problems to being a ripoff is a long way. (and, again, I'm saying this as my personal opinion, as a non-employee of BitDefender, and I assume what I said).

12-days and counting...

One more suggestion: did you try LiveAssistance? Who knows, maybe they can give you the real support that you're waiting for.

Cris.

Hello again!

First of all, any software product has a trial version, which you can use it 30 days, before purchasing the product.

Secondly, it is not our fault that the tech support didn't do basically nothing to help you. This is a matter which we can't fix and we can't do anything about. We are sorry for the incovinience.

Best regards.

By far the best thread on this or any forum in quite some time. I'm a former BD customer who would really like to renew my subscription but cannot because BD, as Orphan most elegantly points out, is INCOMPATABLE WITH VISTA.

Third party software is supposed to work with an OS, not the other way around - hence, the "third party" nomenclature. There's a good reason why Microsoft doesn't advertise Vista as "BitDefender Compatible". Microsoft could have and should have done much better in preparing third party venders for Vista, but they didn't and so...

The point that I've taken away from Orphan's story is not the numerous ways in which BD is incompatible with Vista, that's fairly obvious, but the numerous ways in which SOFTWIN has dropped the ball with their Vista customers. As Orphan notes, I'm not going to pay a company to be a beta tester for their software.

Thanks Orphan!

Hi, i use Bitdefender with Windows Vista, the Total security suite, i also have other 2 pc's with windows xp with the 2008 antivirus, the only issue that i have found it's from windows security center that doesn't detect bitdefender as an antispyware in my vista pc.

Live assistence told me that it's a windows issue, and wait for sp1 or bitdefender upgrade.

On the contrary, i want to explain what bitdefender has done for my security:

1- One of the best euristic engine

2- The fastest and more frequently update signatures ever

3- Protect all my data with identity module

4- no more spam in my mails

5- no more phishing sites

6- An easy and good firewall

and so on

My Pc it's as fast as the first install, and other friends of mine have test this, i see other antivirus products in other Pc's, like nod32 (very fast) or Kaspersky (very acurate), but i found only in Bitdefender a product that combine the two things.

This is the ONLY positive comment regarding Bit Defender that I have seen in four days of reading posts on this forum.. I will be checking back from time to time, just to see if anyone ele agrees with PK77.. No reason, but curiousity, since I have no intention of purchasing BD after what I've read here, about the Product, and the poor support..

The best thing to be said for Bit Defender, is that it appears to have, somehow, earned the devotion of the "Evangalists"..

Bit Defender should appreciate loyalty like this.. Reminisant of a Captain going down with his sinling ship..

90% of people post only for resolve the problems with the product. I see here question like that "antispam works?" or other like "support exist?".

If i have any kind of question i start a live support session, i realy can't remember a issue not resolved or a functionality not explained.

I'm not a Bitdefender evangelist, only a user.

Yes maybe with Avast you'll not experience some issue (but i think it's your windows installation else than Bitdefender), but if you see any other forum maybe you'll find a lack in security that it's a lot bigger problem.

If you realy want to change it's a better choise a product like Kaspersky or Nod32.

So what you are saying is that everybody who has posted here has not installed the operating system properly, except you..

By the way--your last statement above is considered " spam " on this forum.. You can't discuss other products here..

No, speaking about other products it's not spam. This is a public forum, you can speak anything you want. It's true that most of the memebrs are or were BD users, but there also members who don't use BD. However, spam can be considered your double post, because you made 2 similar posts in an interval of 3 minutes; you could have simply used the "Edit" option.

It is all your choice if you use BD or not. No one, and I mean no one can force you to use it. If you wish to stick to free obscure products, go ahead, but don't blame us when you'll come back and ask for help after beeing infected with duzens of malware.

LE: I have deleted your duplicate post.

So what you are saying is that everybody who has posted here has not installed the operating system properly, except you..

By the way--your last statement above is considered " spam " on this forum.. You can't discuss other products here..

Also some\most of the complaints on here are in regards to live chat sessions, lack of support from But Defender, etc, etc,.. If BD won't answer or help a customer, what should they do, wave goodbye to their money, as apparently some have done, or post on this forum in hopes that maybe someone else can\will help..

There are problems and problems. If someone had a lot of incompatibility, module didn't start, work ecc.. i assume maybe it's a bad windows installation else than Bitdefender.

I have 4 pc's, 2 vista installation with, i repeat, Bitdefender Total and one with only the 2008 antivirus, other 2 Pc with windows xp and 2008 antivirus, and i never see this sort of problem, maybe it's just luck, maybe other guys who are posting here post just for the problems they have.

Regarding Spam, it's only an advice, if you want to change software security maybe it's better to point at a good software solution, i'm not speaking about other products, but if you think, or other users think, that suite like avast, with a worse virus detection, euristic engine, no rootkit protection, no firewall, no identity control, no spam protection and phishing module it's better for the number of days of the demo version and a better compatibility (in your sistem), in my opinion this are futile arguments.

I have spoken with Matt and with Vlad in live section and they solved my problems.

And i repeat i'm just a users, not an evangelist.

I see no benefit in questioning the motives or loyalties of the moderators/evangelists. It's clear they're simply volunteers trying to help other BD users and I'm glad they're doing it.

Nevertheless, the frustration that Orphan and others are expressing here concerns the unresponsiveness of a company that is more than willing to take your money in an instant and then effectively disappear (also instantaneously) when the product doesn't work. I complain on this public forum in the hopes that someone from Softwin may actually wander into THEIR forum and notice the dissatisfaction...

They of course never show up here and for good reason. Forums like these ultimately serve as a place to get rid of complaining customers. Those of us who complain through regular channels take up company resources, resources that Softwin is unwilling to expend. This forum is the release valve that eventually weeds out the high-resource-expending customer like myself, and they're able to do this at a cost of absolutely nothing to them. Here's how it works:

1. ignore the customer with a persistent or known-currently-unfixable problem - at zero cost to Softwin.

2. problem customer will either give up and go elsewhere - at zero cost to Softwin.

3. or problem customer will find this forum and get useful help from volunteers - at zero cost to Softwin.

4. if problem customer cannot find useful help at forum, then he/she will eventually cut loses and go elsewhere - at zero cost to Softwin.

And a "quick note" to Pk77:

Thank you sooooo much for pointing out that your Vista computer is working just fine with BitDefender. It’s really amazing! The revelation that YOUR computer is working just fine with BitDefender fixed all my computer problems. I was sitting here in front of the screen reading through the comments and when I came to your comment – badda bing, badda boom – my computer all of a sudden started working like new.

What would we do without people like you, who, in their selfless devotion and dedication to giving out such vital information, impart upon humanity the knowledge that their computers are running just fine. I shudder to think of the consequences of not having periodic revelations that someone’s computer, at some point in time – this very moment perhaps – for some mysterious reason, somewhere on this vast planet of ours, is working just fine.

No, no, sainthood is not good enough for you Pk77. You deserve much better. Bravo Pk77, B R A V O!!

Now if you will excuse me, I’m a little choked up right now and I need to compose myself.

And a note to Orphan: just read Pk77's comments again and make sure you read them out loud so your computer can hear them. I guarantee that your BitDefender difficulties will go away!

QUOTE:

Povertee asked for a pro-BitDefender opinion, for users who, instead of complaints, have something good to say about BitDefender.Finally, Pk77 came here and posted such a positive opinion and what response he gets? That he shouldn't just come here and say that everything works just fine for him? UNQUOTE:

No I did not ask for somebody to post a NEW glowing tribute to BD.. I asked for a link to any post praising BD that was already on the forum at that time.. Which I still have not seen.. Not an after the fact opinion..

QUOTE; What you guys are doing here is called SPAMMING!

Please stop doing this, or you'll get a Warning.

Congrats and good luck with whatever you want to use, but this is an official BD Forum and you are not allowed to start comparing it with other competitor products.

Cris. UNQUOTE:

QUOTE: No, speaking about other products it's not spam. This is a public forum, you can speak anything you want.UNQUOTE:

Well is it spam or not.. You can't have it both ways.. BTW I apologize for the double post.. I did use the EDIT button, and that is what I got--Actually that's the second time--I have another double on here somewhere, again sorry..

QUOTE: BTW...if this forum would disappear, we (the Evangelists) wouldn't be out of a job, because we're not even employees in the first place. .. UNQUOTE:

I know that you are not BD employees, and I suspect you know what I meant by that statement..

QUOTE: We only do this because we want to (and nobody pays us for doing it) and because we like to...UNQUOTE:

and apparently Softwin\Bitdefender can't or won't do it..

QUOTE: but users like you and threads like this really makes me regret I chose this position... UNQUOTE:

Truth hurts does it..

First, I am not now or will I ever be a user of this crap.. Since you have chosen to get personal, let me ask, how YOU (Evangelists) can be so nieve as to not realize that this product ######, that everyone who comes here for help, which they never get as far as I can see, is not stupid.. All I see on most of this forum is excusesw for an inferior product.. I came here researching a product, asked a few questions, that obviously You can't\won't answer, so you start making personal attacks QUOTE: (but users like you )Unquote: . To all the users, on this forum---I think you've lost your money.. No support here, or apparently at Softwin either..

BET THIS POST WON"T LAST LONG. Bet it won't get answered if it does..

Chris,

What part of my note to Pk77 didn't you understand? In plain English: That someone finds it necessary to reveal that their computer is working just fine (on a thread started by Orphan who's having problems with BD and not Povertee) is completely useless information for those of us unfortunate blokes whose computers are not working just fine with BD.

I've encountered this type of comment all too often on these forums. Someone indicates that they're having a problem with X and then someone else comes along and responds with - "Gee my computer is working just fine with X..." Well that's just stupendous! Thanks for sharing. Please share with us the other programs with which your computer works just fine. Meanwhile, I'll just keep banging my head.

Orphan began this thread recounting his less than optimal experiences with Softwin. I've gone through the same sort of silence with Softwin and I really appreciate the time Orphan took to clearly make this experience public.

As I stated earlier, I really wish I could start using BD again. I was a long-time, faithful customer and would like to get back on board. If I had completely written Softwin off, I wouldn't be here wasting my time.

We're upset with Softwin and not with you or the other moderators! Orphan made that clear and I've made that clear.

Yes realy useless information, if i have a problem, and someone not with the same OS maybe there is a fix, if all users have the same problems maybe it's a native bug, i find this sort of feedback usefull.

If BitDefender is such a wonderful ANTIVIRUS, why does your friend, whom has no complaints with BitDefender, have to call you about a VIRUS on his BitDefender protected machine!?!?!?!?

Simple: Nobody EVER said that BitDefender is the supreme Antivirus. Nobody EVER said that it has 101% virus detection. Such protections doesn't exist. My friend was unlucky enough to get a brand new version of Smitfraud, a version that couldn't even be cleaned by the special cleaning tools that you can find on the web. Tested on virustotal, the infected files were detected by 2 out of 32 antiviruses.

My statement above was that BD works perfectly, not that is detects absolutely all threats. Again, if this is what you're looking for, then it might be better to turn off your computert because such thing doesn't exist!

Also, you post that the IDENTITY MODULE on his machine does not work properly, but just because your friend doesn't know how to use the Identity Module or what it does, it is acceptable that this module doesn't work!?!?!?

Who said anything about that module not working? I don't remember saying that!

He didn't know how to disable a feature. In two sentences I told him, he did it, and now everything's just fine. Jesus, you really like to exaggerate things, did you know that?

Cris, YOUR LOGIC ESCAPES ME!!!

And...is this suppose to be my fault?!

Obviously, your good friend couldn't be bothered to read the War and Peace 203-page instruction manual either!

Obviously not. He was too busy trying to clean that virus.

And he's not the only one who didn't read the manual. BitDefender is very simple to use and I find it's interface very intuitive.

I didn't want to say anything about the manual last time you posted about it, but now I have to respond: YES, it has a 203 page manual. So what? IMO, it should have even more pages, because new users might want to have full details over different settings. If the manual has less pages, the instructions would have been insufficient and there would have been more users here asing how to do that, how do to this.

BUT: having a large manual doesn't really mean it's complicated! I could write a 10 page manual for a small tool that I write and build in 5 minutes (let's say...a tool with a small window, and 2 buttons). Would that mean that the 2 buttons are complicated to se, just because it has a 10 page manual? As I said...you really exaggerate some things.

What part of my note to Pk77 didn't you understand? In plain English: That someone finds it necessary to reveal that their computer is working just fine (on a thread started by Orphan who's having problems with BD and not Povertee) is completely useless information for those of us unfortunate blokes whose computers are not working just fine with BD.

Yes, it started like you said.

But, in the meantime, it evolved to be an anti-BitDefender topic. As you can see, buridan, if you read the topic from one head to the other, you'll only see expressions like BD ######, BD is worthless, BD doesn't work at all, etc...

That gives Pk77 the right to come here and post a Pro-BitDefender argument. Or...is it really the fact that you can't stand the fact that BD doesn't work to you, but it works fine to others?

We're upset with Softwin and not with you or the other moderators! Orphan made that clear and I've made that clear.

I understand this. Believe me, I get the same treatment when I contact TechSupport about some issues (NO, not my issues...some issues presented here, on the forum). Being a Moderator counts a lot less than you might think. But, nevertheless, you don't see me come here and shouting about this (maybe it's just because I don't have problems and...maybe it's doesn't affect me that much). I don't know if filling up this forum with complaints will actually help with anything... and that's why this thread is still open.

And let me explain what I just said, so nobody comes back shouting that I want to censor your opinions: coming here and posting your problems is just what this forum is all about. But when a small discussion becomes a very large fight between pros and cons, then usually the thread gets locked (because I hate to see people fighting over here). This thread is still open because I know your right and I understand your frustrations. But still, you are way out of the reasonable line. Yes, BD has a...let's say...slow support. But that doesn't mean the product is the worst thing on the planet. Yes, it has some problems on certain configurations, but it works just fine on other.

BD Support is one thing...but from that to BD is total junk, it's an extremely long way to go. And starting from a true fact, you ended up in, as I said, exaggerating the situation!

Cris.

After reading the new posts and the new complains regarding BD, all I can say is this: even if you have centuries of experience in computers, even if you are programmers, or whatever, even if you are rocket scientists, BD is the same for each and every one of us. I have friends with BD installed, with absolutelly no clue on how the PC work or even what a virus is, however, guess what, they don't have any problems. It is strange however that all thsese problems happended to you, on Vista machines.

AVAST might score a bit lower in virus detection than BitDefender, but AVAST runs flawlessly on my machine , whereas Bitdefender would not, even after reading Pk77s post out loud!

As I mentioned earlier, go ahead and use whatever-AV-you-want, but don't blame us after you'll get infected with hundreds of malware. Strange conception some of you have, "That AV is great, it didn't found any virus on my system", however, did you ever think that even if your AV didn't find anything, you may still be infected? BD still has the best heuristic engine, and the defnitions are updated every hour, not daily, but every hour. Virus analysts work 24/24, they analyse new malware and they add detection, yet still, BD ######. BD is the only security product with both an advanced firewall and an advanced AV, rootkit scanner, heuristic engine, antispam, antiphishing, antispyware, yet BD ######. Have you ever thought that the fault could be yours? Have you ever thought that there might be something wrong with your OS? No, you guys see that BD has problems uninstalling Q.E.D.: BD ###### again. If you ever read that "203 pages War and peace" manual you would have found somewhere saying about "a special uninstall tool, which you can download for free on www.bitdefender.com". Did you uninstall BD using it? Strangely, I always used the unistall tool and I never had problems. I use BD starting with version 8, and I must say that, except 10'th version which had the well known GUI bug, I didn't have any other problem.

First, I am not now or will I ever be a user of this crap.. Since you have chosen to get personal, let me ask, how YOU (Evangelists) can be so nieve as to not realize that this product ######, that everyone who comes here for help, which they never get as far as I can see, is not stupid..

Gimme a break... you really should get a warning for that. I`m taking it as an insult addresed to all moderators. If we would have that opinion about BD, you and your logic would realise that we wouldn't be here, we wouldn't even use BD. Why is BD crap? Because you don't know how to use it. I`m starting to think that the "203 page manual" should start with an introduction in the computer world and how to use the operating system...

I've encountered this type of comment all too often on these forums. Someone indicates that they're having a problem with X and then someone else comes along and responds with - "Gee my computer is working just fine with X..." Well that's just stupendous! Thanks for sharing. Please share with us the other programs with which your computer works just fine. Meanwhile, I'll just keep banging my head.

Hmm... is it really stupid? And don`t you think it`s satrange that only some users have problems with "X", and the rest of them not?

Orphan began this thread recounting his less than optimal experiences with Softwin. I've gone through the same sort of silence with Softwin and I really appreciate the time Orphan took to clearly make this experience public.

Yes, believe it or not, I noticed that. You haven't noticed yet that it's simply BitDefender, and not Softwin anymore, and not due the the "poor product" as Oprhan mentioned, but because other reasons I won't mentione here.

Yes my 4 pcs working well, it's a fact. Your pc maybe not, i think it's a case. I continue using my license product with not problem, regardless your ironic comment.

Really strange thing, isn't it? Some of us don't have any problems with BitDefender...

Gimme a break... you really should get a warning for that. I`m taking it as an insult addresed to all moderators. If we would have that opinion about BD, you and your logic would realise that we wouldn't be here, we wouldn't even use BD. Why is BD crap? Because you don't know how to use it. I`m starting to think that the "203 page manual" should start with an introduction in the computer world and how to use the operating system...

So give me a warning, give me two or three, at least I'll be one of the few who actually got something here.. Seems to be a different story when something is addressed to YOU (Evangelists) but it's OK for YOU to insult anyone who disagrees with what you say.. Please don't forget who laid out the ground rules for this type of exchange.. I was trying to be respectful and polite when asking my questions.. But your buddy CRIS decided to change the rules--OK I can play this way too..

Well since this will probably be my last post ( bet I get banned for disagreeing with you ) I want to tell you that I showed this post to my son, a computer Technian ( NOT a Programmer ).. He in turn showed it to his employer, and they no longer sell Bit Defender.. So it looks like this forum has helped some people anyway..

Now once again let me say that I respect what you are trying to with this forum, (other than the personal attacks, on posters who do not agree with you.. ) However I really do believe your fighting a loosing battle, without some help\support from Softwin\Bitdefender, which even you admit you can't get..

So give me a warning, give me two or three, at least I'll be one of the few who actually got something here.. Seems to be a different story when something is addressed to YOU (Evangelists) but it's OK for YOU to insult anyone who disagrees with what you say.. Please don't forget who laid out the ground rules for this type of exchange.. I was trying to be respectful and polite when asking my questions.. But your buddy CRIS decided to change the rules--OK I can play this way too..

What would you say if we ALL calm down in here? Nodody needs to insult anybody (and, as far as I can see, since now there weren't any insults thrown...at least not the kind that we got on some other topic...and Andrei might remember out our friend from Malware Talk ).

BTW, Povertee, don't mind me asking...what rules did I change? Are you talking about the SPAM definition I've written above? If yes, with what exactly don't you agree from what I said?

If it's about some other rules, please tell me which. I never said anything about any rules...

Well since this will probably be my last post ( bet I get banned for disagreeing with you ) I want to tell you that I showed this post to my son, a computer Technian ( NOT a Programmer ).. He in turn showed it to his employer, and they no longer sell Bit Defender.. So it looks like this forum has helped some people anyway..

I really don't think they stopped selling BitDefender, a very well-known product, with very good reviews everywhere, which won many prizes over the years just because of one user (OK, 3 users " /> ) that just can't make it work. And if he did, that's a very big mistake, from the point of view of marketing. It's about profit, it's not about what I want to sell or not.

If someone wants to buy BitDefender, but he doesn't find it in one store, he'll buy it from somewhere else. Simple.

Cris.

On a positive note. I had uninstalled BD IS 2008 because I had problems and support was not there for me. Today I decided to give it one more try, so, I reinstalled BD after completely reformating and reinstalling all my software and backups. Now BD is working perfectly. I don't really care if it was my system to blame or if BD made some updates. I'm just glad to say I am able to run BD...finally. I have been negative about BD since about my second or third post on this forum, for that I apologize.

Keep a cool head and good things can happen.